Cognizant Teamwork
With Jason McDonald and John Craven of The Broadmoor Manitou and Pikes Peak Cog Railway
JASON MCDONALD AND JOHN CRAVEN OF THE COG RAILWAY TEAM
Climbing into the clouds is a daily occurrence for the Cog Railway team, and under the leadership of Jason McDonald and John Craven, adventure and a pioneering spirit are cultivated and valued. Their uphill ambition behind the scenes keeps this unique operation running smoothly on track each day, for patrons and employees alike.
Hi! Tell us about your positions, tenure and responsibilities here?
Jason (McDonald): Currently I’m Assistant Shop Foreman here at the Railway. I’ve been here since 2013, and I started off as an Engineer. It was noted that I had mechanical skills, and I was brought into the shop and started working on the trains and stuff like that. During the close down, John was the Assistant Shop Foreman at that time, and I was put in charge of a couple of projects that led to the position I have now—that, and my skill set and background of course from the Military and managing people.
John (Craven): I’ve been here approximately ten years. I started out in the shop as a part time seasonal engineer and now am Director of Railway Operations. My responsibilities include doing whatever it takes to keep the place running. Everything from fixing toilets, to making sure that Jason’s got what he needs to keep the trains running, to the parking lots, etc.
Was it a big transition to go from working in the shop to more overseeing of other staff?
John: It’s always difficult to go from working with people to then having the responsibility of making sure everybody is successful. It can be a challenge, but the biggest thing is don’t forget where you come from. And I do think there are some benefits. You know, starting as an engineer and working your way up means you know every little piece that’s going on, and that way when Jason is communicating with me about technical issues, he’s not communicating with someone who has no clue what he’s talking about. I worked in the parking lot, too, and in the facilities for a while, so I know what it’s like and what people are going through. But at the end of the day, there is some pressure to make sure that everyone is taken care of.
Jason: John and a lot of the employees here are friends, but now he’s our boss. So you’ve got to find those boundaries. I feel like we’ve all gone around those really well—at least I feel that on my side. But yeah, that’s one of the big transitions you face when working your way up throughout the course of your career. Some of the guys who have been here longer than me... well, I’m their boss now. Same with John, there are guys who have been here longer than him, but he’s in charge.
In terms of responsibilities, do you guys have a ‘typical day’...or is each day different?
Jason: My days include a lot of scheduling–as far as the train crews and determining who goes out when–and maintenance at the shop. Accommodating individuals can be a challenge, but we get through it. But mostly I feel similar to John in that I’m responsible for keeping the whole shop going and working as a team with Lance, our Shop Foreman, to ensure everything gets done. Now I get to call John and say, “I’m going to spend your money!” He loves those phone calls. He’ll ask, can we do that next week? No, sorry buddy, this is a now thing!
John: As you can see, it’s a lot of moving pieces, but overall, it’s a fun experience for me. And if you throw in the weather and the fact that you’re working with mechanical items, too—it can be very unpredictable.
Jason is kind of downplaying some of the stuff that he has to deal with. Hiring people–full time and seasonal–that’s a big challenge. Balancing all of that is a lot, and he’s minimizing, too, that we have some positions here that have training requirements, and employees have to pass those requirements. If not, then we have to decide it’s better to let them go. Plus, trying to hire people for seasonal positions and getting them in, and trained and qualified, is a delicate balancing act while managing vacations and last minute call-ins. Also, we’re always trying to see if we can add more trains, which adds more stress to him. Adding a train doesn’t just mean adding a couple more people...it affects the whole flow of things. Jason tries to schedule his people so that they have back-to back trains. So when we add a train, if we don’t do it in a certain manner, instead of needing four crews, we will need five crews...but the fifth crew can only take on one train. There’s a lot of stress involved.
We understand that both of you are veterans—thank you so much for your service. Do you feel that your background in the military has been an asset at this job? If so, how and why?
Jason: I’d say yes. During my years in the military, I saw a lot of things and experienced a lot of scenarios. I think that’s what helps me in my position now: being able to mitigate and not stress out. When things go wrong, people often tend to freak out a bit. I don’t do that...I really don’t. I will make a decision, and make sure it’s clear and concise, and make sure that people understand why I’m making that decision. Good stress management is important. Also, in the military I worked with people of many different backgrounds.
What branch were you in?
I was in the Army. I did fifteen active years and six reserve, and I retired at twenty-one years. There’s also the “Here-Now” concept of getting things done in the military. One of the things I learned is “your time is not your time.” So, time is important to me. I make sure to show that I think time is important for my employees. I don’t like to take people’s time unless it’s absolutely necessary. It’s probably one of my faults. I try very hard to give employees the time that they need off...things of that nature. I will go through a schedule 9,000 times and find scenarios where I can make it happen for them. And that’s just because time was important to me when I was in the military for so long, and now that I’m in a position where I can give it back, I do. It’s one of the things that drives me. I want people to have a good environment, enjoy where they’re at, and enjoy what they’re doing.
John: I was in the Air Force, and I would say, very similar to Jason, being able to operate in chaos and not panic.
Jason: They don’t have chaos!
John: You don’t have to be deployed to have military stress! Like Jason said, being able to work with a wide variety of people is important. Being able to deal with situations and not get stressed out is key because that carries on to your coworkers. If you get spiraled up and they see you cave, then chaos can happen. I think personally, the biggest thing military-wise is not to forget where I come from. I had a lot of very unique leaders throughout the military and they really hammered in not to forget that. I should be able to stick my hand in the toilet if I ask someone else to. I should be able to go up there and put on a set of coveralls and help Jason if he needs it. To me, “leader” is a title you can’t give yourself. Either the people that you work with call you a leader, or, you’re not. If the people around you follow you out of respect, you will get ten times the work from them than if they follow you out of fear. I think that’s the biggest thing I got out of being in the military.
Our readers come from many different places in The Broadmoor family, so for those of us not familiar with the Cog, can you give us a summary of the operation and how it fits into the bigger Broadmoor picture?
John: I would say the Cog is another arm or tentacle of The Broadmoor that gives the guest a unique experience that they can’t get anywhere else. Guests come to The Broadmoor for either fine dining, an event, to go fly fishing or stay at Cloud Camp—we are just one more distinct experience that they can tie into their whole trip while they’re here, by taking them up a 14,000 foot mountain. On any given day, the weather can change, animals you see along the route can change, etc.—it’s truly a unique experience for guests.
Jason: I’d agree.
Can you provide a basic layman’s rundown of how the cog train actually works and how it reaches the top of the mountain?
Jason: Yes, it is very unique. There are only a few of them in the world, and even fewer in the United States. As you look at the track, you have three rails, and the center one is the rack rail. Underneath each train, there is a set of gears that mesh with that, and that is what actually goes up and down, and, slows it down. All the drive is all through those teeth, and we measure those annually, too, to make sure they are within a certain spec. The outer rails are just to support weight and steer it; they don’t actually do anything as far as breaking or anything. All the wheels are basically free spin. So the engines on all the trains control the speed of the train, even when coming downhill. They have what we call a dynamic braking or a retarder in the transmission, which slows down the momentum of the train to control the speed. We keep a close eye on the speeds of the trains. We always stay within strict safety boundaries.
We do brake testing on the trains every year to ensure they are safe. We will not put a train in service unless it has passed all the requirements. And actually, for those requirements, we are held to the Swiss standard for braking. Because of the unique area of traversing the canyons, etc., the forces are pretty crazy on those trains. Our newer trains have two engines, and they are electrically driven up the mountain. The older trains have four engines on them and have a transmission.
John: Again, very unique; when we deal with outside railroad people or insurance people, explaining the difference between this and a normal freight train is a challenge.
Approximately how many people are employed at the Cog?
Jason: Normally in the shop we run on a crew of about twenty-four people year-round in order to provide maintenance during our shoulder seasons. This includes our full-time employees and our shop personnel. During high season, we will bump up to forty or fifty staff, depending on how many people we’ve got and how many trains we want to schedule. The good thing is that the schedule is created far enough ahead for me to figure out how I need to bring people in. There is only so much track space and time. So you can’t just bring in twenty to thirty people and then expect them all to train at the same time. When I’m hiring people for the season, I bring them on in phases. A lot of those we hire are college-bound people, so they leave mid-August typically, but some stay through September.
John: That’s drastically changed over the years. Before the rebuild, our staffing was a lot smaller. We’ve grown a lot.
Jason: Yes, eight trains was the max we would run in a day. But this year we set a new record: one day we ran thirteen trains!
John: We also don’t run as late as we used to. We used to offer a 5:20pm train.
So do you start earlier?
Jason: No, we start at the same time as we used to, we have just adjusted the schedule with the rebuild of the track to where the trains have better passings. It used to be that a train would depart every one hour and twenty minutes, and now it’s every forty minutes.
John: And we’re always trying new things with our schedule. For the whole operation, we’re probably at about one hundred people for staffing in total. That number could grow depending on demand. And in the winter, as Jason said, we will trim back down.
It sounds like you have a lot of seasonal employees, so if somebody were interested in applying for a job at the Cog, what is the best time for them to inquire?
John: I would say that they can, and should, apply throughout the year. We have so many different positions that have slightly different seasons. For example, Jason and his team will start really ramping up right about April or May, but our section crew (the individuals that shovel or cut snow) will ramp up even before that. Then you have the parking lot team, which will probably grow around March and then be trimmed down around September. So I would just recommend to keep looking for opportunities throughout the year. There is always something open, and we’ve had a lot of people come in and work a position for a little while, and then realize they want to pivot to another position.
Jason: The bulk of the maintenance is done in January and February, and I start posting summer positions about mid-March. I’ll post for four engineers and four conductors. By the time I get through the process with them, they are trained up by sometime in April. Then they can help with the shoulder season and the trains that get added here and there.
We love that you allow team members to try out different jobs within the organization, and, that you’re open to training them?!
Unanimously, both Jason and John: Oh, yeah!
John: I’m a perfect example of that! I don’t even know how many titles I’ve been fired from to end up here (LOL). One of our employees was really performing well in the parking lot, but looking for something different, so we had that conversation with him and now he is one of the full time engineers.
Jason: Yup, and then another example comes from retail: a staff member there actually is going on to work for Stadler, the Swiss company that built our trains. He just got an engineering job with them!
John: You’re always happy to see someone develop like that. And if we can make a positive impression on them and their career, that’s special.
Jason: I think that one of the things that makes me feel the best is what people write on their resignation letters. It is really impactful! Like, the things you taught me were so valuable or the environment was great—things of that nature are wonderful to hear. You know you did okay if they’re saying that stuff. Or if they cry when they leave and they don’t want to leave! Most people leave or they move away or something like that, and they don’t want to leave.
That’s very telling. Kudos to you guys!
John: Oh that’s all him, I get a totally different response! (LOL)
So what drew you to the train industry? Did past experience in this field help you in your current role?
Jason: My story is a bit crazy. I was going to school for AutoCAD after I got out of the military. I was using my GI Bill, and I was running out of money and had to support my family. So I started looking for jobs, and I saw the posting for this on Craig’s List, and I thought: that sounds like a pretty cool job. I didn’t know what they’d want to do with some army guy, but thought why not try! So I posted my resume and actually got a call the same day for an interview. I never in a million years thought I’d be working in a place like this. Never, ever, ever, and I’ve come to love working here. It’s a fun job. Sure, there are some stressful days, but I don’t go home and sigh or get out of bed and say, “Oh, I gotta go to work.” That’s one of the things that I like about it the most—it’s fun. I enjoy seeing the people here, and we get along well. We get things done. As far as past experience, the reason why they hired me was because I was a mechanic in the military. They saw that I had mechanical ability and brought me in just to drive trains at first, but then there were days when I was changing out a turbo between shifts of trains. I had just thirty minutes to change out a turbo, and I was accustomed to getting stuff done quickly due to my time in the Army—gotta get it back out there! So they brought me into the shop, and I learned and worked my way up from there.
John: Mine’s actually very similar, except you might not want to post it!..haha! Honestly, the whole reason why I’m in the railroad industry came out of wanting to prove someone wrong. When I was retiring out of the military, I interviewed with BNSF Railway. They told me, based on my background that I would probably be a better Cop (which I had already done–I wanted to try something new), and that upset me. But I did end up getting hired by BNSF, being a brakeman and conductor and then becoming an engineer. The environment there wasn’t what I was looking for though; I was looking more for what I found in the military, which was family. So I ended up applying here.
Let’s discuss some of the biggest challenges you face here at the Cog.
Jason: Hiring. Hiring can be a challenge, particularly when trying to find somebody who can last as long as the season is now. Like John said, peak season used to be just from June-August, but it’s getting longer and longer, so adjusting to that is a big challenge. The limited space that we have in this canyon is a challenge, too. There is only so much space we have to grow, as far as trains and storage and stuff like that. The mountain can be a challenge, of course—you never know. You might go up for weeks and weeks with no problem, and then the next thing you know, there is a tree in the way—or an animal!
John: We have had a deer give birth in the middle of the tracks!
Jason: And it wasn’t moving either!
John: We also had a moose stuck on one of our bridges.
Jason: Yes, poor guy. Despite the challenges, we work well to get around them when they arise. We’ve been very creative in solutions, I’d say. The next challenges we’re going to have in the future will be with the new trains and how to take the engines out, stuff like that—our facilities are not equipped to do that. That’s just some of the stuff we think about in the background, and that’s part of my drive. I like to be part of that creative process and figure things out. To be part of those mechanical puzzles, things of that nature. I also like to create, that’s one of the reasons why I stayed. When I was in the shop, Lance would give me the freedom to take initiative and fix things.
John: I would say the same: growth and personnel are going to be our ongoing challenges. Growth just because of our geographical location—that goes for everything from the parking lot (in the sense that we can fit roughly four trains worth of parking there at a time right now) to how do we continue to grow this business with these limitations that are hardened. From a personnel aspect, how do we keep hiring and stay relevant with people? The world is changing whether I want to believe it or not. I have to understand that what attracts me, and makes me want to work, may not be the same for someone else. So staying connected in the hiring world will always be a challenge.
Can you tell us about a rewarding experience, fond memory, or moment that you felt particularly proud or moved to be working for the Cog Railway?
Jason: I’m pretty proud of our rebuild. We kicked butt. We worked really hard and we executed pretty flawlessly I think. There were a lot of challenges we came up against to make it even happen. I think if John hadn’t come up with some of the solutions, there wouldn’t even be a railroad, to be honest. All the logistics—we were worried it just wasn’t possible. The dollar amount would have gone up even further. I mean, $100 million is a lot of money, but I think we spent it well—at least our portion of it. I’m proud of what we all accomplished. I’m proud, too, of what we do now, as far as the amount of trains we’ve got running and stuff like that.
John: When it comes to the rebuild, it was just amazing that we finished under budget and early. Enough said right there! But if you want to go into the weeds, Jason and that team up there, did stuff that the Swiss didn’t think that we could do. We found ways to drive trains in half. We put trains back together on a two percent incline, whereas the normal person stresses putting them together in a sanitary environment where it’s perfectly flat and everything is perfect. We came up with ways to lower down five ton bogies using wenches and fabricated stuff—the list goes on and on. Then throw in the fact that we were working with multiple outside agencies—we were getting the tracks rebuilt, people were sending us parts, etc. Then, take the year following that—that next year was an amazing first year doing things we had never done before. We ran new trains with old ones, etc.
Then you look at the everyday stuff...like this morning for example. We received six tour buses up Ruxton Ave, and everyone got on a train and all their trains left on time, too! Every day we have successes. Section Team – they tackle twelve to fourteen feet of snow on the line and take a chainsaw to the walls to dig a path. Lightening strikes cause us to lose our switches all the time, and they will go up there and fix them. Yesterday, for example, we had to cancel two trains, but ultimately got all the passengers out there. I could pull your ear telling you so many wins! Every day there are little things that make this place run, and the people here are the whole reason why we are successful. It’s a band of misfits, but it is the most unique and authentically good group of people that is willing to go the extra mile. There is no “That’s not my job,” here. People are willing to pick up trash, stick their hand in the toilet… we have people from here, from the shop, that will get on a train to go up and shovel snow! We are very passionate around here.
Is there anything else you can add about the rebuild, since you were both here before and after? How has it impacted the organization?
John: For the people that were involved in it, it showed them what a small group of people here could accomplish. There were just thirteen of us. I mean, our Director of Retail, Carol, was in coveralls in the shop cleaning grease!
Jason: Yes, I had her cleaning axle pieces!
John: I hope people look at the rebuild operation...and say, “Wow!” This bunch of very different, unique and genuine people found the most out of the box solutions to meet challenges head on. For example, the bogies are five tons, our cranes are four tons. We lifted them, and separated them, in mid-air and then turned them sideways. Then squeezed them through polls, which were too narrow.
Jason: Yes, we measured and measured...we were like, “It’s going to work! We’re going to do it!”
John: Yes, we overcame a lot together while collaborating with all these other companies (like the staff who worked on rebuilding the tracks).
Jason: I think another thing that people don’t commend enough is Mr. Anschutz spending $100 million on something that he won’t personally see profit from—that takes a lot of commitment. You often just hear, “The Broadmoor did it,” but that man, he didn’t have to invest in us! He could have taken that $100 million and spent it somewhere else! But no, he put it here. His kids will reap the benefits that he won’t ever see. I think that’s huge for someone of his stature to provide what he did financially for us.
The Cog, as we know, is an extension of The Broadmoor. Logistically, you aren’t close to the main campus...do you sometimes feel disconnected from it and the rest of the team over there? Do you have any suggestions to help bridge the gap?
John: We do have a separate physical location and different job duties compared to the roles at The Broadmoor. I think there was a bigger gap between our entities prior to the rebuild, but that aperture has narrowed more and more since reopening, thanks to the efforts made to include our team in activities and events. Take the Cultural Days for example, when the HR Team includes us by bringing a special lunch to the Depot for us to enjoy (just like the rest of the staff at The Broadmoor)—that is amazing. We get to do Chicken Nugget Day every ten days—that’s huge! And then the relationships are evolving, too. Due to my role, unfortunately I work a lot with HR, but even those relationships have been built up in a good way.
Jason: Or IT! Now when we call IT (and we didn’t really have them as a resource before) it’s like, “Hey, Hikmat, how are you doing!” Or Bryan is always like, “Hey man how are things going!” So the climate has definitely changed in that aspect. And now when we go over there, we can recognize other team members, which is great. Before, you would just email or talk over the phone, and it was like, uh, I don’t know who that person is.
John: Also, when The Broadmoor hosts events, like the Employee Christmas Party, on a day that works with our schedule to attend as a group, that’s huge. When we can go as a team, then our employees often feel more comfortable. Also, they can see us managers interact with Broadmoor staff, which is encouraging to them to build bridges with other people across our organization too. In the military we saw it too! We had different units –like the deployed units and the field units. But it all comes down to building and bettering relationships with others.
Jason: Yeah, like working with Jackie on the Training Team! She puts on great classes, and I want to send people, but she understands that logistically it’s hard when we are running twelve trains a day, especially considering the travel time to get between our campuses. So, understanding the constraints and demands of each other’s businesses is important. Also, this is a railroad, and there’s a specific mindset to have this job, which is different from working in a Forbes Five-Star, AAA Five-Diamond resort. It’s important to acknowledge our differences too.
John: I think as managers, the onus is on us to work towards creating a strong coalition between the two entities. We just have to keep trying to understand each other. The extra efforts The Broadmoor team makes to include us, like bringing us food from the Café, has been incredible. It’s amazing what processed chicken can do for people!
(We couldn’t agree more, John. Chicken Nugget day just makes the world a better place, one nugget and pile of mashed potatoes at time.)
Jason: I think the one thing that I hear that sticks out is that Orientation is Broadmoor-focused, with not a lot of time spent on the Cog. But I explain in my interview with new staff: you’re not going to learn as much about the Cog and what we do here. I try to emphasize you are going to The Broadmoor, and you’re going to learn what they expect of their employees, and then you’ll come back here and learn all of our expectations on top of that.
So do you hold a different, supplemental orientation here?
We have what we call “Ground School.” It’s just one day of learning the ins and outs of the trains and safety and going through our policies and stuff like that. They aren’t exactly the same. Some of our processes are different. When the trains are going out, we are really on a definitive schedule. So, we have everyone clock in right on time. There are different scenarios over here; it’s often just about setting the right expectations.
If someone were interested in developing a career at the Cog, what advice would you give them?
John: Be open minded. You never know where you are going to end up. You could start in the parking lot and end up in Ted’s office, our General Manager. I would also emphasize to get ready to step out of the box and be willing to be part of the team. Like I said, we don’t hear or say “That’s not my job.” We make this work. Embrace the notion that every piece of the puzzle has to not just fit, but also be able to rotate and be another piece.
Jason: I echo that.
John: But I would tell a potential team member, too, that out of all of the places I have worked, (and I’ve worked all over), this is one of the most authentic, amazing and accepting group of individuals that I have ever worked with. That is the whole reason why I am still here. And I know that family is not the word that you’re supposed to use related to work, but I do, because it’s true in this case.
Jason: Yeah, we have people work here and really commute. We have a staff member from Peyton, one from Pueblo, another from Canyon City, and even another from Castle Rock! And despite having a long drive, they arrive with a smile every day. There is something that draws people here—and they want to stay.
John: I mean, most “work” is a delicate balance. How do you make a place fun, but not end up in Human Resources every five minutes, right? At the end of the day, we hope that people stick around because they look around and realize what a unique team they are surrounded by. Maybe they aren’t too excited about certain tasks all the time, but then they see that Jason is in the pit, and Lance is in the bathroom pulling a shirt out of the toilet, etc. So I hope that people hear via word of mouth that this is a fun place to work, but also a good environment in which everyone helps everyone else—we have each other’s backs.
It sounds to us like there are some good folks in charge of this place. :) Anything else you’d like to add?
John: I can’t say it enough: it’s the team. It’s a unique job, in a distinct location, and you’ve got dedicated people working around you. And if you walk around, you’ll see that we’ve got everyone from people who love trains (like, loooooove trains, and wear train pajamas) to others that are on the opposite end of the spectrum.
Jason: We have an eclectic group of people! And ironically, somehow when you put us all together, it just works!
If you would like more information about the Cog, or to connect with either Jason or John, please reach out to them or visit the website.
John Craven: [email protected]
Jason McDonald: [email protected]